Andy
Brooks, the General Secretary of the New Communist Party of Britain, was
interviewed by a member of the International Relations Bureau of the Communist
Party, Turkey (KP) the week before the
European Union referendum. The interview was held at the NCP Party Centre in
London on 13th June and published in the Turkish communist daily
soon after. This translation in based on the text posted on the International
Communist Press (ICP) website which is affiliated to the International
Relations Bureau of the Communist Party, Turkey.
Andy Brooks |
International Communist Press: The EU referendum in
the UK is now one week away. What do you think about EU and the referendum?
Andy Brooks: We vote Leave. We
oppose the EU – we have been opposed to the EU since we were formed in 1977. We
believe that the EU cannot be reformed. The whole Treaty of Rome has to be torn
up. We do not believe there are any positive benefits for the working class in
the EU. The EU is essentially a rich men’s club, a club for big business. It
exists solely to operate in the interests of the big European corporations and
we believe it is dominated by Franco-German imperialism. Whatever minor
benefits have come to workers because of these institutions could easily have
been obtained by other means. For example, freedom of travel. Before 1914 there
were no passports, no barriers. The limitations on travel are a 20th century
phenomenon and freedom of travel could have been introduced anyway, as has
often been said.
ICP: You said you oppose the EU and you will vote
Leave. But in every election you support the Labour Party and now they campaign
to stay in…
AB:
We don’t believe there is a parliamentary road to socialism. We also don’t
believe in standing in elections. So, since 1977 we have called on our
supporters to vote Labour and our party is an affiliate of the Labour
Representation Committee (LRC), which is a committee formed some years ago
whose leading lights were the late Tony Benn and other left social democrats
including Jeremy Corbyn, now the leader of the Labour Party.
We
don’t think there is any point in standing communist candidates. It is
literally divisive. The parliamentary election system in Britain is essentially
a two-party system. At this stage the major progressive working class demands
are for social reforms and we believe that they are best carried out by
reformist parties such as the Labour Party. We see the main struggle being
within that party and the trade unions, and as long as the Labour Party retains
its organic links with the trade unions our policies are unlikely to change.
Lenin himself said, at the time of Ramsay MacDonald in the early 1920s, that
the British Labour Party was a very strange party, unlike any other social
democratic party in Europe. The “strangeness” is that the Labour Party gets
nearly all its members and funding from the trade unions. This is still the
case.
Yes, the Labour Party supports staying in
although there are some individual Labour MPs that oppose this. Just as the
majority of the trade unions support staying in but there are a number of
militant trade unions that oppose this, such as the railway workers unions (RMT
and ASLEF) and the bakers’ union.
ICP: What are your main concerns about the EU? How did
it affect the people?
AB: I am from a
generation that can remember Britain before it joined the EU. Only people of my
age and older can remember the era of cheap food. After we joined the Common
Market one of the fears that was proved totally correct was the increased cost
of living – the cost of food went up astronomically. Nowadays lots of people
don’t realise that the price of food in the EU is the highest in the world. And
it is artificially sustained, previously through food mountains, nowadays by
paying farmers not to grow things. The previous system used in Britain and
countries that weren't in the EU was subsidies. This was designed to help
farmers but keep the prices down; whereas the EU, which is opposed to
subsidies, operates on the principle of keeping the prices up.
ICP: There are a lot of campaigns or fronts that
propose to leave the EU. What do you think of them?
AB: We don’t take
part in the major campaign against the EU. But Lexit [Left Leave Campaign] is
different. We have no problems with Lexit and we report their activities. It’s
a very new movement. We publicise them and encourage our supporters to
participate, but we have our own independent policy.
ICP: Why do you prefer this?
AB: Because the major
opposition to the EU has historically been based on anti-immigration, chauvinist
and racist lines. UKIP, and indeed some who pose as left wing, embrace these
ideas.
The
mainstream campaign against the EU, which is being led by UKIP and Euro-sceptics
within the Conservative Party, is almost entirely based on immigration fears.
We have had, it’s true, a huge number of workers arrive from Eastern Europe in
the last two years – it is possible that London is now the third biggest Polish
city in the world after Warsaw and Chicago. Aside from Polish workers, we also
have a lot from other parts of Eastern Europe.
But the issue of immigration is entirely a
bogus argument and the conservative opponents of the EU have an entirely
reactionary agenda. Their opposition is because they see the EU as a brake on
further neoliberal policies. They also represent the section of the British
ruling class that is afraid of Franco-German imperialism and believed that
British imperialism’s interests are best served in alignment with US
imperialism.
Historically Britain’s policy since World
War II has been to seek US protection for its vast global interests whilst
acting as a bridge between US imperialism and Franco-German imperialism. That
policy was more or less maintained until the Blair government.
ICP: What has been changed?
AB: Blair more or
less burned that bridge by aligning completely with US imperialism in the
Middle East. The Cameron government actually has no close friends in Europe or
America. So the Euro-sceptics, in the main from the Conservative ranks, are
coming from that section which fears German and French imperialism and still
believe that the interests of British imperialism are best maintained in tandem
with the United States.
We
argue that Britain should have an independent foreign policy. The Euro-sceptics
talk about the burden of funding the EU but they never talk about the American
bases in Britain because they approve of them. So, the “independence” they talk
about is not genuine independence but simply about leaving the EU. They don’t
talk about independence from US imperialism. They never openly admit that
British imperialism cannot stand on its own feet.
ICP: How will the
exit of Britain affect the future of the EU?
AB: If Britain leaves
the EU I think it will encourage most of others like Greece, Spain, Portugal
and Cyprus… all those countries crucified by the Troika [the European Central
Bank (ECB), the European Commission (EC) and the International Monetary Fund
(IMF)]. They would see the strength of the demand in Britain for an alternative
and possibly this could lead to the break-up of the EU.
At
the moment some polls put the anti-EU lobby in the lead but we just don’t know
what will happen. If the EU-supporters are defeated they will pull out all the
stops to reverse the result – we suspect that many manoeuvres are being planned
to prevent this [Brexit] happening.
ICP: How will the
exit of Britain affect politics in Britain?
AB: Well, there is no
procedure for leaving the EU and the pro-EU section of the British ruling class
will fight it tooth and nail. Whatever happens, I suspect that David Cameron
will resign. Obviously if the vote goes against him, he will have to go. But
the Conservatives only have a very small majority and it is quite possible that
the Conservative government could collapse. An incoming Labour-led government
would not be bound by this referendum. The leadership, Corbyn and the others
who are pro-EU, may adopt the usual tactic of moving to hold another vote – we
have seen this in Europe whenever the result goes against the EU, many a time.
So we say that a Leave vote should be a colossal vote against the EU.
ICP: Do you think
leaving the EU is a step forward on the road to socialism?
AB: Well, it may not
be a step forward, but it will represent a defeat for the bourgeoisie, or at
least one section of it. A step for socialism only depends on the strength and
the militancy of the working class as a whole. We believe only the communists
can emancipate the working class.
ICP: Thank you very much, we really appreciate
the interview.
AB: It was a
pleasure, thank you very much.